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Unread 2017-06-17, 05:19 PM   #1
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Default Tax, Tax, and Tax again (but vote for me)

The leftist solution to any problem is for the government to take money from people who have more than the government thinks you should have and give to those who have less. It's easy to propose taxes on 20% of the people and give it to the other 80% so they will vote for you and keep you in power.

Remember, Hitler's boogeyman was the Jew, todays leftist boogeyman is the rich (people who have more than you do).

You can only tax people so much before you run out of money, then what do you do to stay in power?



The hoarding of the American Dream


Cliffs: The top 20%, upper middle class are hoarding the American dream and not allowing the rest to participate. The leftist author proposes we tax the upper 20% and redistribute to the lower class so they can have things like free kindergarten etc.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/marke...MQq?li=BBnb7Kz
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Unread 2017-06-17, 07:47 PM   #2
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Fuck that guy. My household falls in the upper middle class top 20% earners. I'm tired of more taxes. They are sucking me dry and not even swallowing. Richard V Reeves can go suck a fat one.
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Unread 2017-06-18, 12:20 PM   #3
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Yet, compartively speaking with respect to tax to income ratio, the middle class and poor (to some extent) pay more in taxes than the wealthy, all things considered. Then you've got other things like healthcare costs and general cost of living considerations which have a more profound impact on the poor and middle class's ability to survive and hope to have a chance at succeeding.

There's no easy answer here.

I'm all for helping out if it works out better for the collective good so as long as it's managed and designed appropriately. I'm NOT supportive of all day kindergarten, but that's another topic all together. LOL
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Unread 2017-06-18, 05:45 PM   #4
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Yet, compartively speaking with respect to tax to income ratio, the middle class and poor (to some extent) pay more in taxes than the wealthy, all things considered. Then you've got other things like healthcare costs and general cost of living considerations which have a more profound impact on the poor and middle class's ability to survive and hope to have a chance at succeeding.

There's no easy answer here.

I'm all for helping out if it works out better for the collective good so as long as it's managed and designed appropriately. I'm NOT supportive of all day kindergarten, but that's another topic all together. LOL
Of course the answer is easy.

Just tax the top 2% 60% of their income. No dedhctions, no loopholes, etc.
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Unread 2017-06-18, 07:40 PM   #5
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Of course the answer is easy.

Just tax the top 2% 60% of their income. No dedhctions, no loopholes, etc.
You forget the top 2% doesnt have much of an income w2 like most of us poor people. To get anything out of the 2% you would have to tax assetd which includes properties and corporate ownership.
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Unread 2017-06-18, 08:00 PM   #6
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Historically speaking, we are in a period of time with the lowest burden on the rich and highest burden on low and middle income, tax wise.

Pre-regan and trickledown economics, the highest tax bracket was 70%+. This is back in the 'golden era' that a lot of baby boomers look back to as the good ol' times.

I don't believe that we need to raise taxes that high for the top brackets again, but please realize that the rich pay lower taxes now than they ever have before. Our deficit stopped being balanced during and after Regan, when we moved to the trickle down model. It's simply not sustainable, long term.

Source: http://federal-tax-rates.insidegov.com/
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Unread 2017-06-18, 08:21 PM   #7
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People are so nieve on taxes and believe the fake media. Our deficit has nothing to do with taxes. Tax revenues to the treasury keep increasing every year. Our defecit problem is all about spending.

The government kerps implementing new programs and expanding ecisting programs increasing the defecit. Without a reduction in spending thete is not enough tax money out yhete to collect.

So many peopl believe the fallacy that we could tax the rich and pay for everything its not possible. We could confiscate all of the wralth of the top 10% and not cover the 20 trillion defecit.

All of this crap we argue about on here, abortion, tax the rich, social security and government programs is designed to divide people and keep the ruling class in power.

If Trump were part od the ruling class he would have gotten a free pass on everything he has done. He is not so even if he were a choir boy they would be doing the same crap they are now to him.

One day people might wake up and see what is going on but i doubt it. People are just too selfish and self centered.
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Unread 2017-06-18, 10:28 PM   #8
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...Did DIY just stroke out?
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Unread 2017-06-18, 11:00 PM   #9
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...Did DIY just stroke out?
No just trying to let people in on the secret.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 02:13 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by DIYAutoRepair View Post
People are so nieve on taxes and believe the fake media. Our deficit has nothing to do with taxes. Tax revenues to the treasury keep increasing every year. Our defecit problem is all about spending.

The government kerps implementing new programs and expanding ecisting programs increasing the defecit. Without a reduction in spending thete is not enough tax money out yhete to collect.

So many peopl believe the fallacy that we could tax the rich and pay for everything its not possible. We could confiscate all of the wralth of the top 10% and not cover the 20 trillion defecit.

All of this crap we argue about on here, abortion, tax the rich, social security and government programs is designed to divide people and keep the ruling class in power.

If Trump were part od the ruling class he would have gotten a free pass on everything he has done. He is not so even if he were a choir boy they would be doing the same crap they are now to him.

One day people might wake up and see what is going on but i doubt it. People are just too selfish and self centered.

Ask me how I know you're drunk...
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Unread 2017-06-19, 08:38 AM   #11
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It is always easy to spend someone else's money. That goes for politicians, or people voting to expand social programs that they do not have to pay for.

The super rich are not the ones that usually get screwed. People or households working to make low, to low/mid 6 figures. They are the ones that will get the shaft. At that point, you get a decent size tax burden but make too much to take a lot of the standard deductions. The income looks good on paper, but you get screwed from both ends when it comes to taxes.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 09:11 AM   #12
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The super rich are not the ones that usually get screwed. People or households working to make low, to low/mid 6 figures. They are the ones that will get the shaft. At that point, you get a decent size tax burden but make too much to take a lot of the standard deductions. The income looks good on paper, but you get screwed from both ends when it comes to taxes.
Yep. If you make ~$55K-120K, you're the one that pays the "most" when it comes to taxes, healthcare, etc., comparatively speaking. I have no issues with the more wealthy paying more into the system so that their overall tax and take home % is on a more level playing field with the other classes in this country. I do agree that the tax revenue needs to be better managed, but that's always been an issue for any government. Everyone has their ideas of what's important thus the desire for so many programs.

I make lower 6 six figures, have two kids, a stay at home wife and live a pretty damn good life. My finances are very strong and I know I've got it good compared to most in this country. With that said, it's very hard for me to feel sorry for my friends bitching about their tax burden making $200K-350K when they're living in $350-450K homes, have new and nice cars, boats, very expensive hobbies, kids in numerous club sports, go out all the time, take lots of expensive vacations, etc. They've still got pretty freaking good, all things considered.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 09:43 AM   #13
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With that said, it's very hard for me to feel sorry for my friends bitching about their tax burden making $200K-350K when they're living in $350-450K homes, have new and nice cars, boats, very expensive hobbies, kids in numerous club sports, go out all the time, take lots of expensive vacations, etc. They've still got pretty freaking good, all things considered.
woah woah woah... slow your roll there pinko snowflake... my life is hard, I've worked for every dollar, never getting a break because I'm white, straight and male, and now you and your liberal elite friends want to make me pay a % of my income that is commiserate with the % paid by people in the middle class?

income inequality isn't so bad that the top 10% make more than the bottom 90% in 2015 is it? (oh, yeah, it is... oops)

the idea that someone doesn't understand taxing the wealthy more than the poor blows me away. imo, its a good sign that they've not ever lived near the 'hand to mouth' level of income... I have worked hard to get where I am but if the idea of America as a meritocracy is to continue, I cannot support leaving a large portion of our country behind simply because they were born to the wrong people or into the wrong situation. there is a baseline of "stuff" that kids need to have a real chance (food, education, healthcare, etc) to make something of their lives and not be dependent and in order to pay for that, some of the people that have made more of what they were given need to be asked/told to pay more.

the math is pretty clear that we can't tax everyone the same and expect people in the lower 50% of income/wealth to have even generational chances at prospering/making America better.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 11:05 AM   #14
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Seriously, the rich cannot keep getting richer and richer without the middle class dying off and becoming part of the lower/poor class. There is only so much to go around. Most people in this country are not expecting handouts and work pretty hard. They just want a fair shot and the playing field level.

I'm heavily invested and do quite well from it though my investment wealth is probably peanuts compared to the super wealthy/1%. However, I'm experienced enough to understand that when you've got well positioned investment wealth, it can grow nicely and quite fast. Meaning: The rich get richer, even with the market is shit.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 12:11 PM   #15
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Seriously, the rich cannot keep getting richer and richer without the middle class dying off and becoming part of the lower/poor class. There is only so much to go around. Most people in this country are not expecting handouts and work pretty hard. They just want a fair shot and the playing field level.
You seem to be missing my point, the government will never receive additional money by taxing the rich at high levels.

When Regan took office the top rate was 70%, the rich were not paying that, they got around it. The Warren Buffets and Bill Gates will never pay a large percentage in taxes, they can get around it. The only people paying a lot in taxes are those under the 250K range. They are mostly W2 employees.

The bottom 50% of the people pay no income taxes, most of the bottom 25% actually receive more money from the government than they pay into it. The financial burden of this country falls mostly on the 40% of the people who earn between 50K and 250K, with those making ~50K paying a much smaller percentage of their income in taxes than the 250K.

The people who feel it most are the 50 - 150K because while they are paying a smaller percentage of their income in taxes, they are paying a lot more of their disposable income in taxes. As envious DaveB pointed out, he is paying a higher percentage of his disposable income in taxes than the people he knows who are earning 350K.

People who propose taxing the rich and keep electing Dems in office are just putting in people who are taxing them more, ironic
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Unread 2017-06-19, 12:30 PM   #16
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So are you for or against closing loopholes and/or trying to get the rich to pay more taxes so that people like us don't have to shoulder the burden quite as hard?
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Unread 2017-06-19, 12:36 PM   #17
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So are you for or against closing loopholes and/or trying to get the rich to pay more taxes so that people like us don't have to shoulder the burden quite as hard?

Where do you draw your line at with who the rich are when it comes to taxable income?
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Unread 2017-06-19, 12:36 PM   #18
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Loopholes should be closed. A simple flat tax would be so much easier, no loopholes, hiding money, etc.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:07 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by 69Mach351 View Post
It is always easy to spend someone else's money. That goes for politicians, or people voting to expand social programs that they do not have to pay for.

The super rich are not the ones that usually get screwed. People or households working to make low, to low/mid 6 figures. They are the ones that will get the shaft. At that point, you get a decent size tax burden but make too much to take a lot of the standard deductions. The income looks good on paper, but you get screwed from both ends when it comes to taxes.
If you think a six figure family is getting shafted on taxes and needs some tax relief, maybe you are the one who needs to pull their self up by their boot straps... in the midwest that is more than enough income to live comfortably. of course I would like my fiancee and I to make more than that eventually, but we have pretty much everything we want and have no financial stress...

i don't think those are the families being argued about here. those making in the upper two-thirds of six figures are the ones who can stand to be taxed at a much higher rate, in my opinion. it has been proven time and again that at a societal level, when the wealthy have to pay more towards social programs like education, infrastructure, et cetera, society benefits a lot more than it would if they were allowed to continue to bilk the middle class and hoard their wealth.

i don't think anybody in this thread is arguing for communism or for "welfare queens" (which is hilariously how most conservatives picture all recipients of social welfare) to get rich of the backs of others. conservatives need to stop trying to turn everything into extremes and to polarize the issue of taxation.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:09 PM   #20
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Where do you draw your line at with who the rich are when it comes to taxable income?
So are you for or against closing loopholes and/or trying increase taxes in the highest tax bracket so that people like us don't have to shoulder the burden quite as hard?

Reformulated the question to better define what I mean. I believe the top tax bracket starts just above $400,000.

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Loopholes should be closed. A simple flat tax would be so much easier, no loopholes, hiding money, etc.
A simple flat tax completely fucks low wage workers. A progressive/bracketed tax is much more logical. I do agree that we should close many loopholes and simplify the system.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:15 PM   #21
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Where do you draw your line at with who the rich are when it comes to taxable income?
Well, DaveB would draw the line about what he makes, low $100K; while ShaunY thinks DaveB makes plenty and should quit whining.

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If you think a six figure family is getting shafted on taxes and needs some tax relief, maybe you are the one who needs to pull their self up by their boot straps... in the midwest that is more than enough income to live comfortably. of course I would like my fiancee and I to make more than that eventually, but we have pretty much everything we want and have no financial stress...
So, the answer to this is, the people who need to pay more taxes are those who make more than whoever you are asking.

I think the top tax bracket should be set at 10K below what Keboh makes.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:31 PM   #22
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Well, DaveB would draw the line about what he makes, low $100K; while ShaunY thinks DaveB makes plenty and should quit whining.



So, the answer to this is, the people who need to pay more taxes are those who make more than whoever you are asking.

I think the top tax bracket should be set at 10K below what Keboh makes.
Dave B also said he is more than comfortable and he's supporting 3 other people at that income. Do you struggle with reading comprehension? I only spoke about that number in reference to another poster. Try again hombre.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:38 PM   #23
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Dave B also said he is more than comfortable and he's supporting 3 other people at that income. Do you struggle with reading comprehension? I only spoke about that number in reference to another poster. Try again hombre.


Dave is also debt free, has no house payment, and may not even have a balance on his car note.


If we are going to place Dave as the example for all in that bracket (the vast minority), then we should look at the small percentage of poor people that dig themselves out of poverty with zero assistance as the example for those asking for said public assistance.
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:40 PM   #24
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So are you for or against closing loopholes and/or trying increase taxes in the highest tax bracket so that people like us don't have to shoulder the burden quite as hard?

Reformulated the question to better define what I mean. I believe the top tax bracket starts just above $400,000.


Well, just as 69Mach351 stated, it sure is easy to spend other people's money.


Why aren't you offering to pony up more of your income? I mean, these programs are critical, right?
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Unread 2017-06-19, 01:54 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by jwdb1fish View Post
Well, just as 69Mach351 stated, it sure is easy to spend other people's money.


Why aren't you offering to pony up more of your income? I mean, these programs are critical, right?
Per DIY, middle class wage earners between 50-150k shoulder the highest burden. I simply asked him if he supports raising taxes on the highest earners to alleviate some of that burden from us middle class earners because, per his opinion, those of us in that range are hit the hardest with taxes.
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